Dorothy: [00:00:00] Native Houstonian, Dr. Damien Kelly, has served in social service organizations for over 15 years. He knows about working in non profit organizations, and he’s seen firsthand what happens when communities do not have access to care. He has been a director of multiple organizations and he now is refocusing his career to align with research initiatives.
He has an unwavering belief that today’s research can lead to tomorrow’s cure. And as a member of the Health Research Institute at the University of Houston, he’s here to talk about some of the social determinants like income, education, and access to health care, and how that influences the breast cancer outcomes in different communities. He is truly a breath of fresh air for a subject that is often misunderstood and creates barriers all of [00:01:00] its own.
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Let’s Talk About Your Breasts, a different kind of podcast presented to you by The Rose. Center of Excellence and a Texas treasure. You’re going to hear Frank discussions about tough topics and you’re going to learn why knowing about your breasts could save your life.
So Damien, thank you so much for being with us today. And this is going to be a different kind of podcast, right? You’re interviewing me, but I hope to be able to interview you. Um, And I know you said we don’t have to, but actually you’re Dr. Kelly. And tell us a little bit about your background and what brought you [00:02:00] here?
Damien: Oh boy. No problem. Yeah. So thank you so much for, I get to be on The Rose. I’ve actually been listening to some of your guys episodes. I love your interview style. It’s, it’s not so much an interview, it’s more of a conversation. And I really appreciate that when you guys are doing your thing. So Rose, you are, The Rose here is fantastic.
Dorothy, I love the studio. The staff is great. So I’m doing my little plugs, what not to tell people who behind the scenes doing all this, they do such great work. So what brought me here? Oh my goodness, that’s a, that’s a, maybe a long story. So—
Dorothy: We’ll shorten it up a little bit.
Damien: Gotcha. So I did about 20 years in social services, uh, working at the Houston Housing Authority, uh, Catholic Charities. I still run a homeless drop in center on Sundays called Open Gate, which for homeless youth predominantly. I’ve done that for about seven plus years. Um, I got my doctorate in May of 2022 and decided to switch to social science. So I applied for some jobs and the University of Houston at the time, Dr. Obasi was our PI, [00:03:00] and he said, Hey, I want to give you a shot. We had a great interview. We really just talked about his research. And we had a third minute conversation about research and he said, Oh, I’ll call you in a couple of weeks and I’m going to make my decision or whatnot. I got a call like two days later, Hey, we want you on board.
So I’ve been here ever since. It’s been a blessing to just be with the people at U of H, the health RCMI, they do such great work. It’s a research center in, uh, for minority institutes. And U of H is an HSI, Hispanic Servant Institute. There are a few of those here in Texas. And what’s great about the work we do, we really get to, it’s community based science.
So we really get to engage with communities and things that they’re actively participating in and things that care about. And you really get to, once you disseminate some of these projects, once they’re done, you really get to see how they make impacts pretty fast. So I’ve always kind of had that idea that if I got, if I was blessed enough to get into science, I don’t want to do the science that sits on a shelf somewhere and it’s kind of filed away. You know, it was done. I want stuff that’s actually [00:04:00] going to be able to be put in people’s hands and people can like, Oh wow, this is, I never thought about it this way. Or I’ve never looked at this before.
Dorothy: Yeah. But what a, what a background you bring. If you’ve been down there in the trenches, I mean, but really there’s a difference in knowing and experiencing no matter what. So and I know, you know, I’m on the community advisory board, which blessed to be on it. Never sure why, you know, because there’s so many brilliant, brilliant people involved in, uh, the health program and, and their Institute.
Damien: Yes, ma’am.
Dorothy: And it’s, it’s beyond just smart. They are really thoughtful in how they provide the startup grants and how they, and how the whole thing is working. I’ve been incredibly impressed to be a part of any small part of that program.
Damien: Yes, ma’am. We’re blessed to have you.
Dorothy: Oh, thank you. So how, what brought you here today? What are we talking about?
Damien: So, one of the things I do at U [00:05:00] of H, I have a podcast called Speak Your Peace, and we interviewed tons of people, uh, really who are local people making those impacts. I love talking to people who are boots on the ground and who are engaging with different people in different, uh, uh, aspects of life.
I’ve always kind of had that thought in my head that, you know, if you’re in a pulpit and you’re preaching to an audience or you’re preaching to the congregation, the people in the congregation navigate through life differently than you do, than that preacher does. They see things at a different level. I want to talk to the people who are kind of at that level, who are, who may be kind of in the pool, but they spend a lot of time down in the trenches doing the work, getting things done. And I want to see things from their perspective. So I was like, you know, we’re re upping our podcast again. It’s been, uh, since Dr. Abbasi did leave the university, uh, he’s gone on, I believe Wayne State. So he’s great. We have some new people in charge. Dr. Beets is fantastic. So we’re bringing back to our podcast.
We’re like, well, who can we [00:06:00] start talking to that way we can start disseminating this information to? Like The Rose came up in conversation. I was like, well, yeah, I’ve, I’ve seen you. Uh, so now most of us, most of the world, now we are all telecommuting. We’re all working virtually. So I’ve seen your square in your face on like a teams or a zoom meeting, but I’ve never got to meet you in person.
And I’m like, okay, this is a great chance to shake hands. And hey, how are you? I love listening to you when you’re in these meetings. I want to know how you got here today? What, what is so special about what you guys do here at The Rose? I know from kind of like a back end, but I want to see how our participants can kind of engage you guys as well.
Dorothy: Okay, so The Rose is basically here because we don’t want any woman or man to die from breast cancer because they cannot afford the cost of a mammogram. Basic. That’s it. We serve 40,000 people a year. Uh, we do mammograms and ultrasounds and [00:07:00] diagnostic workups and biopsies and physician consults. But the most important thing we do is to get that uninsured woman who’s been diagnosed with breast cancer into treatment?
You know, you could, there’s lots of programs out there you can get a mammogram. Lot of them are going to tell you, Oh, you’ve got a problem here. Very few, especially if you don’t have money, don’t have insurance, they’re going to get you into treatment. And, and that is what we’re all about. You know, it’s, access to care has been it from the beginning.
Damien: Yes, ma’am.
Dorothy: I was 38 years old, and in the beginning, uh, my life was not going to be in non profits, guarantee you.
Damien: Okay.
Dorothy: And, uh, but Dr. Dixie Melillo, general surgeon, doing breast surgeries, as well as all kind of other surgeries was seeing a lot of late stage breast cancer. My job was to get her out in the community and talk [00:08:00] about the importance of mammography, the importance of having a mammogram, and the hospital we were both at uh, had a dedicated breast center. So, for me, I’m a marketing person.
Damien: Okay.
Dorothy: For me, to get to sit and listen to her talk to groups and to hear the questions the women ask. It was, you couldn’t get that kind of education anywhere else. You know, it was, it was such a new modality, had a lot of pushback. Most doctors were not going to recommend it. It wasn’t covered by insurance. So, I mean, if you had a problem, it might have been covered, but not screening. And then we met a wonderful woman named Rose Kushner, who told us to get off our butts and go start a non profit and stop talking about it. And uh, so Dixie’s married name at the time was Rose. My maiden name [00:09:00] was Rose. We’d met Rose Kushner. That’s how we This place got called The Rose. We decided we needed to do something for her. And anyone that wants to look up her background, she was a journalist for the Baltimore Sun.
Damien: I thought you guys were out of D. C. or you were out of D. C., correct?
Dorothy: No, no.
Damien: Well, you don’t sound like you’re from the South.
Dorothy: Okay. It was just her. We started something in D. C. We were a mentor for a group that got started in D. C. But when she, when Rose found a lump in her breast, her doctor told her he was just going to go in and do her surgery. If it was breast cancer, he’d do her mastectomy. He’d come out and put the ask her husband if it was okay. Rose said, Huh? I mean, this woman was the first female journalist to cover a Vietnam. I mean, she stood about five feet tall. She had a mouth on her that no one could be easy around. And she was going to tell you how it was.
And she said, There is no way you are going to take my breast off without me making that decision. Damien, it took her 16 doctors. [00:10:00] 16, before she found someone who would let her wake up and make that decision. Now this is ’79.
Damien: Yes, ma’am.
Dorothy: Standard of care back then.
Damien: I got you different times.
Dorothy: But it’s because Rose Kushner went to, she said you’ll never change anything if you don’t change policy.
Damien: Yes, ma’am.
Dorothy: She said you can talk all day long, you can educate all day long. But until you change those policies, then it won’t make any difference. And sure enough, she did. She got Medicare to cover screening. She got the two stage procedure put in place. I mean, I can go down the list, but she, for me, she was my hero. She was, you know, I, I was so. It’s not even, blessed, it’s not even in the world. To get to meet someone that you know about, you’ve read her book, and you’re sitting at the same table with her.
Damien: Oh yeah. You have the whole fangirl experience.
Dorothy: Oh my gosh, yeah. There was nothing I wouldn’t have done for her, but you have to know, she called me every Friday and said, well, have you started your nonprofit? I’m working a full [00:11:00] time job there. You know, I’m not going to start a non profit. And then she called me the next week. Well, what senator have you called about this bill? I don’t know any senators. You know, it was like, it went on for months. So, think about that. Who have you ever done that for? Who have I ever done that for? You know, I think we all need a Rose in our life. Or we need to be a Rose.
Damien: Yes, ma’am.
Dorothy: To someone else.
Damien: What’s that? I guess like a mentor or that motivator that kind of sees the potential that you don’t see in yourself.
Dorothy: Right, right. And, and I’ve always objected to the word mentor.
Damien: Okay.
Dorothy: I do not know why. It just always felt kind of formal or kind of whatever, but to have someone care that much.
Damien: Yes, ma’am.
Dorothy: And not about us, but about what we could do.
Damien: Yes, ma’am.
Dorothy: That’s a whole different kind of caring. You know, and then to stay on you for it.
Damien: I love that. Okay, so I don’t [00:12:00] have any, do you have some? There we go. Because your eyes were watering up a little bit. I’m happy. I’m like, she’s going to smear the makeup.
Dorothy: Thank you. No, I’m not. No, I’m not. But I mean, really.
Damien: Well, I’m going to smear my makeup. There we go. That’s what’s going to happen.
Dorothy: You have to. You know, it, it was a different time. This was in the mid 80s. This was the, during the oil bust. This was when more foreclosures were happening than any other time in Texas. People were out of work. They didn’t have insurance. Women were coming to us with cancers that had outgrown outside their breast and were sitting there like two pounds of hamburger. And it was my job because I was a medical photographer. To take those pictures. Believe me, that’s not a picture you ever want to even see, much less smell.
Damien: Oh yeah.
Dorothy: Cancer has its own way of making itself known. It doesn’t just go away.
Damien: Yes, ma’am. So flash forward to 2024, where are we now? I know women hopefully don’t have to see 16 [00:13:00] doctors like that.
Dorothy: Nothing has changed in so many ways.
Damien: Okay. Elaborate.
Dorothy: They’re still uninsured, more than we can take care of who do not have access to care and, and we’re still dealing with the same, not same treatments, better detection, better treatment, but we’re still dealing with breast cancer. I mean, there was a time in the 90s when they talked of cure. Think about it, 38 years later, we still don’t have that cure. The still, the, the best thing we can do is get that mammogram, catch it early, and have the right treatment. Have access to treatment.
Damien: Wow. It’s, I guess it’s kind of daunting when you talk, when you hear the race for the cure, we’re going to try to cure this, or it, you haven’t, we haven’t cured a lot of things. We’ve, we’ve made some strides, we’ve made some detections, like you’re saying, and [00:14:00] we, we have some great strides when it comes to technology, but I still know so many women who’ve kind of gone through the, the scare of breast cancer and, uh, those mammograms and, um, Oh my goodness, it’s, I’ve, I’ve heard some interesting stories and trying to go through and like, well, what do I do? Who can I go? And it’s that kind of, who is in my life that I can turn to where I can, someone’s going to, I guess, shepherd me through this process because it is a process. It’s endless appointments. It’s talk conversations with insurance companies and see if this is covered, that’s covered. Please, you know about this than I do.
So please elaborate what’s going on with insurance companies. How come we’re not. Oh. Let me ask that question better. What do we need to do to get insurance companies on board with what’s happening?
Dorothy: Well, I think for the most part, for all the face value, all the right words that are being said, insurance companies are pretty much on board. What we need is to have comprehensive health care for [00:15:00] everyone.
Damien: Gotcha.
Dorothy: You know, nothing has changed, especially in the state of Texas, when it comes to care for the uninsured, for the low income. And for women, it is the worst. Good for children. Women, no. So, that’s, that’s an area we could really use a lot of change.
Now, I have all my own opinions about insurance. And what the heck is this prior authorization all about? What the heck does, do, uh, I have to prove that my doctor who went to school, you know, for 16 years doesn’t know what he or she just ordered. I mean, and that, that could get me going. And, and the other part of is there a system of automatic denials because you might not you might not go back and challenge. You, the patient who’s paying for this, might not go back and challenge. You, the company who filed for it and know it’s a legitimate cost and a legitimate charge, might miss that 30 day [00:16:00] window of appeals. Yeah. It’s a system. Yes, ma’am. I don’t want to call it racket, but it’s a system.
Damien: It seems that as we’ve automated certain things, as we’ve included more technology, a lot more checks and balances have come with that also. Meaning there’s a lot more steps involved in trying to get to the prostate, to the care that you really need. Doctors know you need it. You know you need it, but you have to go through a lot of issues just to try to get things. What’s going on?
I wonder if there’s, I’m sure I’m not the first person to think of streamlining some things, but the podcast you did, uh, previously, uh, there was something you guys mentioned. You said putting yourself on that To-Do list, and that really stood out to me. I think that was with Brooke Baugh. Saying it right?
Dorothy: Yeah.
Damien: Baugh. Okay. Baugh. Yeah. She was, I was very, it was a lovely podcast. I was listening to her. And I was like, well, with all the things that are kind of, maybe stumbling blocks to getting what you need. [00:17:00] How do you put yourself on that checklist? How do you develop that system where like, okay, there’s an appeal process. Who do I go to? Is there someone I can talk to who’s maybe like an advocate that I can go through and kind of go through these things, and they can help me be on that, you know, that to do list?
Dorothy: You know, every insurance company has what they call navigators, or people that are supposed to help you.
Damien: Oh wow.
Dorothy: I think the thing you’ve got to find is within that provider, someone who’s going to also be your champion.
Damien: Hmm.
Dorothy: Now, this is a different scenario altogether, Damien. But at the end of our, of, of The Rose’s work, when we take that uninsured woman, she is being, Shephered, that’s a good word, by a patient navigator. Because, first of all, a lot of our women, English is not their first language. Trying to go down to any medical center or health care system can be daunting. And so, our ladies, who are street savvy, speak the language, understand, have done this for [00:18:00] years. Understand what the next step is going to be and why are right there with them. Sometimes going with them to that first appointment to make sure that doctor is understanding they’ve got to talk in a different way.
And then, some of the things that we have to do in treatment, it’s really important, the timing. And so, if our navigators call the patient and she says, I can’t this week, I can’t get off work, then it’s our navigators who just say, you know, they’re, let me talk with your employer.
This is timing. It will be more effective if you get it this week. So would you know that? No, I don’t care if you’re insured or educated. You don’t know all these things. So I wish we had a patient navigator for everyone. No matter what your problem was, to walk with you and get you through it. You know, if you haven’t been there, you won’t know.
And every breast, there’s 17 different kinds of breast cancers. That means all the [00:19:00] different kinds of treatments. There’s no one journey that’s the same as the next one. So you’ve got to know all those things. What if that woman can’t pay her rent that week? I mean, that’s where the navigator is. Again, low income, uninsured. But that’s where they step in to go, look, there’s a service over here we might be able to apply for. Just, there’s just too many barriers, but they’re more than barriers. They’re like walls, they’re like roadblocks that women can’t get around. And then they have to deal with the family dynamics. Then they have to deal with caregivers who wish they could fix things and feel helpless.
And now the woman is not wanting to talk. I mean, go through the whole scenario. Back to your question. Insured women have the same issues many times. You know, you tell me I’ve got to [00:20:00] come back for a diagnostic. I’m 35 years old. You know, my insurance ain’t going to cover it. It’s going to come out of my deductible. It could be a thousand dollars. I don’t have a thousand dollars. I mean, go down the list. She’s going to have all the same types of barriers that are going to stop her and say, do I really have to have this? What if it’s nothing? It’s probably nothing. My doctor said it’s probably nothing. I mean, you know, we’re, where do we find that good information? And we all know it isn’t Dr. Google. You know, we, we know we’ve got to find some places we can trust for a woman to find that time. And, and, you know, I, I hate to always say for a woman. Because I know plenty of men that don’t want to go to the doctor.
Damien: Yes. Um, you look dry at me like, yes, I don’t like, I, I, Dr. Heidi, I love you to death. She’s a fan. She’s my doctor. She’s fantastic. But no, I do not look forward to going to the doctor.
Dorothy: And if you, a male, [00:21:00] found a lump in your breast, cancer would not be your first thought.
Damien: I don’t know what I, oh my goodness. I don’t know what I would think.
Dorothy: I got bruised. I got hurt. Oh, it must have been when I picked up that whole bag of mulch there. I hurt myself. Yard work.
Damien: That’s what I go to. That’s what I go to.
Dorothy: And unless that man, unless he had some other issue that will discover it or mentions it to his wife or mother. He’ll never get to a mammogram and you will be surprised how many times it is cancer.
Damien: Yes, ma’am.
Dorothy: So, you know, we never want a discount that men get cancer too, breast cancer, and it can be lethal. It affects so much more than in women because it’s there already. We’re not screening men. We’re not going to find it little bitty. But for women, you know, think about the women in your life. Who do they take care of first? They’re a family.
You know, I guarantee you that kid is not going to not [00:22:00] get to the doctor, not get to their shots, not, you know, we’re not, we’re gonna make sure that happens. But for me, the woman, mmm, gonna make sure my husband knows when he needs to go, gonna make sure my brother knows.
Damien: Yes, ma’am.
Dorothy: But, not, I’m gonna, that’s why that putting yourself on the list, and you know, I’d love you, love it to be the first thing on that list, but It’s hard to even get on the list with so many other commitments.
Damien: You know, uh, when you were talking earlier about, you know, kind of the wall and what people kind of go through and those kind of, those stumbling blocks, I’ve noticed, especially in social services, once you, at some point, your energy to keep running through these walls slows down, you’re like, there’s another thing, there’s another, I got to do this now also. And I thought we just did that. And. What does a success story look like to The Rose? Like I know you have many when you’re helping people, these [00:23:00] navigators kind of go through these things and say, you know what? We’re going to, we’re going to go over this wall and I’m going to lift you up. You’re going to put your foot on my hand. I’m going to help you get over the wall. We’re going over the wall together instead of trying to go through it by yourself.
Dorothy: There’s so many. I think Courtney, 36 years old, 23 weeks pregnant. Found her cancer, she had to have chemo during those last months of her pregnancy.
Damien: Yes, ma’am.
Dorothy: Uh, lots and lots of issues, uninsured, got her through that. There was one issue after another, because see, the program we get them on is the Breast and Cervical Cancer Program. Fabulous program.
Damien: Gotcha.
Dorothy: It’s a Medicaid product. Not fabulous. Every six months she’s in there having to reapply. She’s in the middle of getting her drains out. And they said, Oh, by the way, your insurance is not valid anymore. She calls, she calls our navigator, our navigator calls the state.
Damien: Yeah.
Dorothy: Well, there was one thing she’d forgot to sign — [00:24:00] or they didn’t have it.
Damien: Yeah.
Dorothy: She said she had turned it in. She received it the day after Beryl and guess when it was due? The day of Beryl. Didn’t get to her in time. They got it cleared up so that she did not have to leave that office and come back. But imagine.
Damien: Yes, ma’am.
Dorothy: You know, that’s Courtney now, both kids. She had another child, a little one, uh, when she was pregnant. The baby, uh, live well, running all over the place, and now she’s back at doing what she did all her life, teaching school. Okay. Success story? Absolutely. But more than that, because now, here’s her words, I learned to speak up for myself. I learned to challenge things. I knew if I didn’t know, I could go back to The Rose and ask, but I learned how to, how to speak up. And I thought, that’s [00:25:00] the story. You know, I’m glad she’s alive. I’m delighted all of this has come out well for her, but she can speak up. And she spoke up on a very, uh, sensitive subject in that her first doctor, who was not her color, did not look like her, sound like her.
Damien: Okay.
Dorothy: Just kind of blew her off. Ah, you’re nursing. Yeah, that’s not anything. What do you mean? You can’t have breast cancer. You’re too young. All the things that black women most often hear, which is never too young to have breast cancer. Our youngest was 18.
Damien: You hear these stories all the time of young people having some form of cancer, and it’s just, oh my goodness. That is, I’m a parent. My daughter’s 11 years old. How do you shepherd the parents to that process when they have such a young person who’s 18, 19, [00:26:00] 20, going through this, not even knowing if to buy us a beer yet, going with through these life changes. How do you work with the parents and those loved ones who are like, I want to be here to help. I honestly don’t know how.
Dorothy: You know, I think, remember, my folks are not counselors. They’re not licensed for any of that. We have folks that we can turn to if we need that. I think what our people do is to give them that place to talk it out. And honestly, more often, we are trying to work with the children than parents or even spouses.
Damien: Gotcha.
Dorothy: Uh, and I remember one story the, the navigators told me about, they had the two children in, the mother is there, and they’re saying, now when you have your chemo, you know, your hair most likely will fall out. The kids are going looking and, and, and our navigator said to him, but that means it’s working.
Damien: Hmm.
Dorothy: And so she gets a call. Several months later, Oh, oh, Miss [00:27:00] Elizabeth, it’s working. Mama’s hair fell out today. Well, you know, is that technically true? But is it what got them through that time? Absolutely.
Damien: That’s what they need to hear.
Dorothy: That’s what they need to hear.
Damien: You have such great stories with the people you’re working with here. What’s interesting is by the time this comes out, maybe the election is already come and gone. It’s an election year. Don’t care who you’re voting for.
Dorothy: Vote for humanity.
Damien: Yes.
Dorothy: Vote for humanity.
Damien: How do you see that playing out when it comes to breast cancer, breast cancer awareness, your organization, no matter who wins?
Dorothy: You know, it doesn’t, it doesn’t matter who’s in office. Breast cancer is going to be here.
Damien: Yes.
Dorothy: We have, we have great bills in front of the House, in the Senate right now, in front of Congress. Let’s get them through.
Damien: Yes.
Dorothy: They have to do with eliminating what I just shared with you about Courtney having to sign [00:28:00] something every six months. It has to do with trying to expand the CARES program, which has been around since 1991.
Damien: Okay.
Dorothy: And the only way we’re going to expand it as if states will contribute more money towards it. Remember, it’s a Medicaid product. The word we can’t say here in Texas. That’s, that’s how it will expand. I mean, it has some other components. It added some other, uh, uh, different things about the breast cancer procedures that are needed. All good. All good. Needs to cover more people. That’s, that’s it in a nutshell.
Damien: Oh, wow. So what are the stumbling blocks right now for that? Is it tax purposes? Is that what’s holding things up? People don’t want to pay the extra money or?
Dorothy: You know, it’s a budgeting process.
Damien: It seems like everything is.
Dorothy: Who covers the budget? Who decides what goes into our state budget?
Damien: Hmm.
Dorothy: Tell me. How much more rainy day funds do we need when we have people [00:29:00] dying every day because they can’t access care?
Damien: Yeah, so when you run for office—
Dorothy: I’m never running for office.
Damien: You got my vote.
Dorothy: Hey, hey, never gonna run for office.
Damien: Well, never say never.
Dorothy: Too old, too wise. to be honest. And much too successful to care about that.
Damien: Those last two, I agree with. Too wise and too successful. I completely understand that also. With what you guys do here now, uh, we’ve gotten a lot of focus right now at the university when it comes to AI, uh, artificial intelligence. Automating systems. How has AI impacted some of the things that you guys are doing here at The Rose?
Dorothy: You know, our radiologists are excited about what it could do. Our producer of this podcast is always pushing me to do that, to use AI more than my own language or my own wording.
Damien: What would that look like for you?
Dorothy: He might bring that around to me someday, but—
Damien: Is it, is it Freddy? Is it, is it?
Dorothy: Yeah, it’s Freddy he’s always trying to push us a little further. You know, I think [00:30:00] AI has, it’s already here. We better learn to embrace it or, or we won’t stay up. Uh, but I also think we need to be careful that we’re using our own brains. That we, we can still put a sentence together. That we don’t always need help and that we, as you, your podcast says, we learn how to speak our peace. We, we know what we, we know what we feel and what we need to say.
Damien: I’m excited definitely for the future, what holds when it comes to AI. I’m looking forward to all the, uh, cool elaborate, uh, things we collaborations we can do with The Rose. I know there’s so much more work to be done. Uh, you guys are looking, uh, looking at talking about your peer navigators. People, some of the people, have they experienced breast cancer as well, and that’s what makes them kind of know the process so well?
Dorothy: No, I don’t think it’s that. I mean, I have breast cancer patients that are in my staff. I think it’s more that we all know what it [00:31:00] was like to be down and out at least once in our life. And if you’ve never been there, then lucky you. But most of us know what it’s like. So, I think that’s what motivates them. I think when they see the women come back who are healthy and moving on, all of those things.
Damien: Hmm.
Dorothy: So as we close, okay. What what’s your — what final burning question do you have?
Damien: Oh my God. So, so I put my laptop down because I’m like, okay, we’re actually have more of a conversation now, but I can actually go through a couple of things actually. But, uh, we’ve actually talked about the medical coverage thing. That was, that’s one of the things I was so very curious about is, I’m going to move this a little closer. Uh, why is it so hard for people to get that adequate coverage to get what they’re looking for? It seems again, as, We have integrated so much technology, the process should be easier.
Dorothy: [00:32:00] It’s about money. If you don’t have the money, you’re not going to have insurance. If you don’t have insurance, you’re not going to have access to care.
Damien: Yeah. And it’s, it’s, it’s sad that we’re still in that realm to where you have people now who are like, okay, I can either pay for my medication, pay for whatever service I need, my mammogram, et cetera. Or I can pay for my food in the fridge. I can’t do both. It’s sad that in our first world country, the greatest, I still believe the greatest country on earth, we still have people making these decisions that do I pay for my mortgage? Do I pay my rent? Do I keep the lights on? Or do I get my life saving medicine?
Dorothy: You know Damien, I don’t think there’s a single answer for that. But here’s the difference between 38 years ago and today. We’re talking. [00:33:00] That’s going to be what makes a difference.
Damien: Yes, ma’am. A lot of the stuff we talked about still always goes back to that, that coverage question. And it’s one of those burning things that, you know, hey, I have a job. I’m working. Why isn’t this covered? Or why do I have to go through this? I’m paying my taxes.
Dorothy: Why did, why did Obamacare fail? Because when businesses were required to cover, you know, they couldn’t make it. It’s all a matter of money.
Damien: Yeah.
Dorothy: I think we’re gonna have to have another podcast, Damien. I think that we have barely covered this, this subject.
Damien: We haven’t talked about my cowboys yet. We haven’t talked about your sports teams. There’s so much more territory we have to uncover with this.
Dorothy: That is not what we talk about here Let’s Talk About Your Breasts.
Damien: Okay, fair.
Dorothy: But I do think we’ve covered a lot.
Damien: Yes, ma’am.
Dorothy: Thank you so much for being with us and for being our guest today. And for having me as a guest on yours.
Damien: God bless you.
Dorothy: Boy, that’s a, that’s a honor.
Damien: You know what? It’s an honor speaking with you. I love the work you guys are doing here at The Rose. It’s fantastic. You guys are doing life [00:34:00] saving services. And anything we can do to get the word out about the stuff you guys are doing, it’s an honor to be a part of that process.
Dorothy: We appreciate it. We need all the help we can get.
Damien: Yes, ma’am.
Post-Credits: Thank you for joining us today on Let’s Talk About Your Breasts. This podcast is produced by Speke Podcasting and brought to you by The Rose. Visit therose.org to learn more about our organization. Subscribe to our podcast. Share episodes with friends, and join the conversation on social media using #LetsTalkAboutYourBreasts. We welcome your feedback and suggestions. Consider supporting The Rose. Your gift can make the difference to a person in need. And remember, self care is not selfish, it’s essential.
